I wasent about to go through basic again, the first time was enough. It would have been 8 years if it hadnt taken forever for the OCS process but with the outlook I was seeing was 10-12 years. Besides resigning before finishing OCS is catogorized as a defective enlistment. If you fail to complete OCS for any reason your discharge will be catorgorized as a defective enlistement.

With my PE licence, education and experence my SPN/RE code will likely not even be brought up it will be listed as administrative and if it is a line item on a job application I will be honest but for professional jobs I have not seen it yet and I dont plan on putting it on my resume, in fact it is already off. In fact it should not even effect a civilian security clearance becasue the reason for discharge was not security clearance related. In order for a discharge to effect you negitivly is obvioiusly if it is dishonorable (ie you were actually convicted of a felony) or if the discharge was directly related to what you are applying for (ie if I were applying for a flight job and I were discharged from the military for neglegance as it applies directly to flying, I dident preflight the plane, I was to tired and crashed it, etc then it would effect it)

I'm sure thats the case rppearso, no really I believe you. I'm sure your internship is going great....

Im not an intern im an engineer working towards my PE.

Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me!
Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me!
Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me!
Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me!
Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me!
Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me!

What do you do HarryP? You never seem to have any good rebukes.

quote:

or I could say that they wanted me to sign up for an additional 6 years before entering flight school

I missed this little gem. So you're going to tell someone who is looking for someone who will be stable, hardworking and eager to work their way up in the company, that you were unwilling to give time back for the expensive training you were about to receive (flight training) which would really have been no monetary cost to you. A lot companies now are offering to pay for you to go to college at the expense of them, do you think that them paying for you to go to college will be a handout? Don't know if you know this or not rppearso, nothing in this world is free. You gotta give something to get something.

Of course, living at home with the folks and mooching off of them all your life, you wouldn't know that concept. I don't see you lasting long anywhere until you learn some basic survival skills.

The whole thing with the army was a mess, criticle issues were not disclosed before hand. The mentality and hazing was totaly in left field, there were alot of things that I was not ok with. Where as with a good organization they will say we want this for this, 4 years working here for X training. You keep demonizing me when it was the military that failed to disclose its requirements up front, if they would have said after all the who ha you will be in for 10-12 I would have said no thank you. Also they kept stating that OCS was a professional school and that could not be farther from reality, its basic training part 2.

Attention! Attention on Deck!

You had a contract spelling it all out for you. Do you want me to scan in an OCS contract from the National Guard?!? Its right here in my desk, next to an Active Army OCS contract. We disclosed everything! There isn't any disappearing ink rrpearso, nor small small print. We said we'd let you become a candidate. Hence OFFICER CANDIDATE SCHOOL. You failed, you still owe us for the training and monetary investment in you. No one promised you a pilot position. Its not in your contract, it wasn't promised. Your contract said what your MSO was, 8 years, and what was required to get a commission. Don't try to weasel out of it, like the National Guard or Army did you wrong! I put people in the Army for Pete's sake! I see these contracts day in and out, and you honestly expect me to believe your disenfranchised garbage?!? You have your PhD alright, Piled Higher and Deeper. You never got commissioned, you were never an officer, you were never MOS qualified, because you never completed the program. Understood? Good. Therefore, you can't resign, because you weren't an officer. Logic achieved? Good. You still failed to tell everyone in the forum, your contract stated what would happen if you fail to complete OCS. It was on page two, Paragraph 3(b)-I understand that if I fail to complete the training specified above, fail to obtain the required security clearance, fail to successfully complete any phase of training, or otherwise become disqualified for commission/appointment, I will be required to complete the 3-year term of this enlistment in accordance with the needs of the Army in an enlisted status. I will serve the remainder of my military service obligation as required by law. It repeated again in 4(c) as well. So, your entire story is a bunch of shit. I am tired of your same old song and dance. We can't make it any clearer. Other than that, I don't mind debating with you, but drop this crap story.

And your sure there is nothing in there at all about a defective enlistment agreement, I read it in the OCS candidate hand book, I know its in there but it is unpopular with recruiters. A pilot slot was not in my contract but I was not even told about it verbally when my intentions to become a pilot were known which is omission of information.

Either way if I were forced to stay in would you want to fight along side me?

Warrant Officer flight training is guarenteed pilot slot, OCS, isn't. OCS is needs of the army first. If they need you somewhere else, guess what, thats where you're going. It's your fault for not making sure it was on the contract before you signed and raised your right hand. It wasn't your commanders fault, it wasn't the recruiters fault, it was YOUR fault.

rppearso

quote:

What do you do HarryP? You never seem to have any good rebukes.

You have never said anything worth the effort to rebuke (which is really bad word usage) because it is based on someone who, despite a college education, seems to have avoided learning anything other than what was necessary to achieve the minimum requirements.

All you need to know about me (and I have stated what I do before when responding to you) is that I have more formal education than you and one hell of a lot more education in life (as most people on this site) than you can hope for in your current status as a semi-professional whiner. You keep throwing out the fact that you are educated and feel somehow entitled to better treatment than other people. Has it ever occurred to you that education is merely a measure of one’s ability to comprehend a specific subject matter and comes with no entitlements or special privileges?

You have a one-note outlook on anything to do with the military and it is based on you inability to understand the written or spoken word unless it falls into a narrowly defined belief system that you have created to avoid the reality of life. After several postings on several subjects you keep stating the same thing over and over and being told over and over that we (on this site) do not agree with your opinions, yet, you have not seemed to have caught on to that fact or are of the mistaken belief that you can somehow convince us that we are wrong (as if that could happen).

The amount of tolerance for you on this site is a testament to the intelligence of its members because they are, for the most part, trying to convince you that life is not a simple as you seem to think and there are two sides to every argument and both should be respected. You have shown almost no respect for anyone’s opinion and will not get any until you do (human nature is alive). As a final point – you ignore any honest attempt to discuss anyone refuting your attempts at endless rationalization.

That is a good point, I would have to agree. Ok, the opinions that I have even though they are just my opinions drive the decisions that I make in life including the desicion to leave the military. It is agreed that life is short and time can not be bought back, or at least that time can not be bought back. I found myself in a bad situation (In my opinion) in the military, so I did what ever I had to do to remedy the situation, in the end it truly is irrelavant who's fault it was, it is what it is. Sucking it up would have ment burning time that I would not have been able to get back (thats a fact) and would have degraded my quality of life (thats my opinion) because knowing that I have to keep going back month after month made the rest of my month a little bit crummyer (again my opninion). So I had to do what I had to do to get myself out of a bad situation (bad in my opinion) which included droping out of OCS and going up to 32% body fat which would prevent me from attending any AIT training (correct me if im wrong cavscout) and I would eventually be discharged (I do believe this is also a fact AR-600-9, correct me if im wrong), if you think this course of action is dishonorable that is your opinion. I have very specific goals and anything that diverges from my focus is a hinderance. I thought that some of my analogies would have made sense but I guess not. Like someone else choosing your major in college for you (to me that is equivalant to the army saying "needs of the army first"). It seems to me that to "not" be a whiner you have to just bend over and take it, in my personal opinion I would rather be a whiner than bend over and take it in the rear.

Why should I put the armys needs above my own when they are so ready to send me home in a box

ok, but every comes home in a box at some point in life. what the military was attempting to do was to provide you the means to delay that date.

32% body fat? damn son....you must of had bigger tits than my ol lady!!!!

Its mostly abs area, I do miss the body I had when I power lifted for 3 years and was at 24% but I will get it back, its hard when you sit at a desk for 9 hours a day (not a bad thing because I like my job) and go flying and study for tests at a desk at home. I have kept up a little once or twice a week lifting and I still have most of my strength, I also had my basic training injury when I got back and dident want to run so it would not get anymore injured than what it did getting ram roded through basic for fear of being recycled (sorry thats a side issue).

How does the military delay that date, cavscout shooting me in the back would expidite that date

by making a soldier out of you. you know, teaching you the basics and that when the pin is removed, Mr Grenade is not yer friend...

I wouldn't shoot you in the back! I have the common courtesy of letting you see your salvation delivered by Mr. 9mm Beretta. I'm not a complete jerk.

For the record, 24% body fat is in no way healthy, nor is being able to "power-lift." (In which being big and capable of lifting large amounts of weight for an engineer, seems like compensation for something) Neither are indicative of well-being or health, nor fitness. I'm almost 5'10" and weigh roughly 155 pounds, but I can strap an additional 85 pounds of gear to me, and ruck 25+ miles a day or run flat-out for a half-mile. I'm extremely fit, healthy, and am nowhere near double digits of body fat percentage. I average about 7 %. Most anything over 20% is considered a fat kid. Most males range between 15-17%. 16%ers being primarily tennis and hockey players. 24% is almost a quarter of your body being fat.

I can still hoist a full keg of beer up onto my shoulders and take it upstairs to the bathtub filled with ice...does that count?

Being shot from the front or back by your own guy still expidites rather than delays. 24% was good enough to enlist as an 09S so the military must not think its fat. I was 218 going into basic and still a few lbs over 200 when I finished. yep and 32% is a third. But when you dont have time to excersize every day its tough to maintain 24% body fat. I did power lifting because I enjoyed it, I hated running and disliked walking, lifting weights still burns calories and is better than sitting on the couch.

It is kinda a catch 22 because you need 25% to initially get in but 22% to go to OCS so that leaves a 3% nomans land, if you dident take it off in basic its unlikely you will take it off sitting at a desk. They shouldent even enlist you unless you can maintain below 20% on a day to day lifestyle. But that is just my opinion. I am curoius as to what the attrition rate is for body fat/PT discharges, you only have 6 months according to AR600-9 thats not much time to loose 13%.

Of all the people to reference Catch-22, I knew it would be you.