May as well call a spade a spade son. Its called 'cowardice' under fire. Runing from the enemy while engaged also falls under the same term. It ain't desertion.

If a coward even makes it to trial, and is convicted, he goes to Leavenworth.

And a Dishonorable Discharge before getting there.

Wow thats pretty hard core for freezing up, im surprised we dont hear about all kinds of court martialings seeing I doubt every soldier on the ground is a hard core god of war, im sure we have freeze ups and you dont hear about court martials that result in sentences to leavenworth, thats usually fairly big news. Either that or they just fire there weapon without aiming for fear of persecution. Who knows, I just cant imagin everyone out there is gung ho when the rounds start to fly for the first time. and then as soon as someone freezes they are pulled off the line and sent to leavenworth.

Me thinks that the subtly of direct speech is lost on you.

???

Ah, yes it is!

direct speech is not lost on me but I find it very hard to believe that you can go to jail for something that is not a crime or at least it is not obvoiusly immoral to justify it being illegal.

quote:

Originally posted by rppearso:
???

One of the perfectly clear thoughts you've managed to make. I pick on your grammar NOT to deflect your point. But, BECAUSE I DON'T UNDERSTAND YOUR POINT. When you ramble on with incoherent snippets of thought, YOU understand it. Hardly anybody else can.

rrpearso,

I will put it to you, like I do my young soldiers. It IS A CRIME to NEGLECT your buddy, and NOT FIGHT. It is COWARDICE, a crime in the UCMJ. Conduct unbecoming before the enemy. Minimum punishment, LEAVENWORTH. Maximum punishment, DEATH. Negligent homicide. Premeditated Murder. Manslaughter. Refusal of Duty. Failure to Obey Lawful Orders. Loss/Destruction of Government Property. These can all play into a court-martial for cowardice. Instead, I'll save Uncle Sam some money, and put a bullet in you, save trial for someone more important.

And you dont think that is hard core, you dont think that if you have documented proof that you were mentally unfit for combat to your commander that you would still be found guilty in a court martial. If a commander knowingly puts someone in a combat roll that is mentaly unfit you still think that is the individuals fault? You dont think its murder for shooting someone in the back who should have never been there to begin with?

Thats why there is a psychological screening before you take a job in the military. Everyone gets a psych eval. You pass it, its just an excuse. You don't pass it, you're out of the service. No dice, your logic failed.

Protecting the lives of my men, and myself, is an exercise in self-preservation. Prudence is the better part of valor. Its is wise and prudent to cut the cancer out as soon as its identified, as to not destroy the rest of the being. In combat, which I have experienced fully, I would rather kill the sandbag and survive, accomplishing my mission, and write a letter to his family, then have to pick up the slack for a coward, potentially losing my own life in the process. Scouts don't have the luxury of being able to send someone back inside the wire when they don't perform. You cut them loose, or risk compromise and death. Guys like me don't get killed, we are captured and beaten, interrogated, tortured, then killed. Its how the reconnaissance world works. The rest of the military relies on our recon work to shape the battlefield. The military will gladly send little Sally-wanted-to-be-a-killer home in a box, than 32 Scouts and Sally. Yes, it is HARDCORE. Thats what the world is. Survival is HARDCORE. My mission is HARDCORE. My failure is unacceptable, and if I fail, I hope I don't make it back to reap my HARDCORE punishment. Its HARDCORE to sleep at night to know you cost hundreds of people their lives. Thats why I'm perfect at what I do. I will not have that on my conscience. Thats HARDCORE.

I guess I wasent in long enough to get the psych eval, MEPS was not a psych eval. The military gladly sends people home in boxes so dont be surprised when people dont respect the military. I understand certian jobs in the military have to do what they have to do but when someone realizes they dont belong in that hardcore unit, sending them in anyway is murder they should be reassigned to KP or cooking not sent to there deaths with cavscout. Or refuse the orders and spend a few months in levenworth or whatever, at least you are alive. The military changed me from a republican to a democrate.

quote:

The military changed me from a republican to a democrate

What does this have to do with anything? There are many many democrats in the military right as we speak. And many are fighting in Iraq and Afghanistan! Say it ain't sooo!!

What the military did to you was, make you realize that you're a spineless jellyfish. It didn't change your political affiliation, it just pushed you to the side that has more sympathizers for pathetic cowards like yourself.

hmmm, like minds perhaps? most democraps are a total waste of human skin.

Democrats represent a very large percentage of the population sometimes the majority sometimes not but never a "vocal minority" when you join the military you may be under orders of a democrap.

you are the one that brought politics into the mix. I served under Commander in Chiefs from both parties, and by far serving under Republican leadership was sooo much better for the nation and the military.

face it, you went democrap only because when you originally joined, didn't think it possible that you could have ended up in Iraq or Afganistan.

I dident think it possible to be caught in OCS land for so long and having to sign on for more time to go to flight school. Was Clinton really that bad for the military? And I dident think iraq would still be going on after all of the training I would have to go through, I joined the guard because I wanted part time pilot full time engineer. Some things in life just dont work out.

I have been gone from the guard for like 5 months and they still havent sent the navy seals after me yet.

Clinton was a charismatic President that allowed Bin Laden to slip through his fingers. Reckon he was focused more on getting blow jobs huh?

Clinton: I smoked pot, (but didn't inhale) (I did not have sex with that woman) yeah he was just soooo good for the country and the military.

Or is this part of history that democraps (like you) chose to not recall?

Still, he was our Commander In Chief, and we went where we were told, and did what we were expected and ordered to do.

Ain't no such thing as a quick war. Just because Gulf War I appeared to be over in 96 hours, is a misconception by many. Saddass invaded Kuwait on 12 August, and I was stepping off a 747 in Saudi on August 20th 8 days later. I didn't leave until May 30th the following year.

The first gulf war was bush senior, then during clinton we dident have these major year at a time deployments then bush junior gets into office and we have more long drawn out wars with 12 and 24 month deployments.

quote:

Originally posted by rrpearso:

...and we have more long drawn out wars with 12 and 24 month deployments.

So, Clinton had no responsibility for the 12 month rotations to IFOR/KFOR in Bosnia? That was a major deployment. Or what about Somalia and Task Force Ranger? That was a year deployment. Check your history.

Do you enjoy paying taxes rrpearso? If we deployed for a couple of days, your taxes would have to increase exponentially. It costs more than $68 million to ship 5200 men and their equipment overseas. That cost cannot be incurred at such frequencies and supported by the budget for short term deployments. Its bad business...sending it their for a year is much more cost effective. GIs deployed to Vietnam for a year, so I fail to see where you get your data to support this claim. GIs deployed to Korea and WWII for even longer terms. Its called the Big Picture. Grab a seat and take a look.